Working on the question of how to make SD more applicable in the "management world" for half a decade now.
One main obstacle is when starting with the real name, SD, the listening manager will close up. The whole thing is just not known to him. So are you listening to somebody who is telling you something you don't know? Probably not.
Starting small with the Standard Method, http://systemdynamics.org/wiki/index.ph ... #Education, will lead to best results.
The customer (wether it is a manager of your company or a client) has to not feel "one down" as he would when an expert is telling him about SD.
Wonder what you think of that approach?
Ideas on how to "sell" SD to managers
Hi Ralf,
that's exactly what I have in mind. Every time I met a manager or an executive I try to describe what the methodology is and I lost them immediately. Also the potential benefits are quite obscure to them, because when they heard that there is modelling involved they close their ears....
I think this is an area where we may need to write something, maybe an article. Is anybody interested ?
Giovanni
that's exactly what I have in mind. Every time I met a manager or an executive I try to describe what the methodology is and I lost them immediately. Also the potential benefits are quite obscure to them, because when they heard that there is modelling involved they close their ears....
I think this is an area where we may need to write something, maybe an article. Is anybody interested ?
Giovanni
selling SD to managers
Hi Giovanni
There are different type of managers and their motivation will be very different.
I can see mainly two kinds.
The first kind are executives that are mere employees, even if they are chief executives and do not risk their own monney in the business. They work mainly in big businesses.
the second kind work in smaller firmas, and are at the same time managers and riks their monney or fortune and live with the risk of bankruptcy that they will personnaly assume.
These prople think very differently. The first people will not take the risk of investing on a method which is not vastly recognized and will not even take the time to study it. If the work done is not efficient they will have to justify their error and it will be bad for their career.
The second categoy think very differently. They generally do not have to justify as much their error to other people and do not mind their carreer but the risk or the real opportunity for their business. They are concerned with a long time horizon while people from the first category have much more shorter horizon, as long as it concerns the firma they are working in. The first category of managers are mercenaries.
Most of the managers prospected by Sd consultants are from the first category, and probably extremely few from the second one.
Belonging to the second category of managers, I do not think that I can bring a help to the problem of promoting SD in a business environment.
Regards.
JJ
There are different type of managers and their motivation will be very different.
I can see mainly two kinds.
The first kind are executives that are mere employees, even if they are chief executives and do not risk their own monney in the business. They work mainly in big businesses.
the second kind work in smaller firmas, and are at the same time managers and riks their monney or fortune and live with the risk of bankruptcy that they will personnaly assume.
These prople think very differently. The first people will not take the risk of investing on a method which is not vastly recognized and will not even take the time to study it. If the work done is not efficient they will have to justify their error and it will be bad for their career.
The second categoy think very differently. They generally do not have to justify as much their error to other people and do not mind their carreer but the risk or the real opportunity for their business. They are concerned with a long time horizon while people from the first category have much more shorter horizon, as long as it concerns the firma they are working in. The first category of managers are mercenaries.
Most of the managers prospected by Sd consultants are from the first category, and probably extremely few from the second one.
Belonging to the second category of managers, I do not think that I can bring a help to the problem of promoting SD in a business environment.
Regards.
JJ
Hi JJ,
I agree with you, probably it's not correct to say "we want to target SD to business people". And I agree that type 1 managers will not be willing to invest time in studying and trying new techniques and approaches. Probably the best target is a category of "visionary people" that can be enterpreneur like you or , generally speaking people, with open mind that are not interested only in controlling and making the quarterly targets. So we need to narrow the target. I think that SD will never become a "mass-product" but I hope to find some visionary people out there!
Thanks for your contribution, always appreciated.
G
I agree with you, probably it's not correct to say "we want to target SD to business people". And I agree that type 1 managers will not be willing to invest time in studying and trying new techniques and approaches. Probably the best target is a category of "visionary people" that can be enterpreneur like you or , generally speaking people, with open mind that are not interested only in controlling and making the quarterly targets. So we need to narrow the target. I think that SD will never become a "mass-product" but I hope to find some visionary people out there!
Thanks for your contribution, always appreciated.
G
Hi Giovanni,
Hi JJ,
I have lived and worked in an environment (BMW Plant Leipzig) where the plant manager has been a strong promoter of SD. However within the middle-part of the organization you always deal with the kind of managers who -at first sight- resist the new method.
Here lies the chance to change the current thinking. It only needs the quick wins to show them the benefits in short time (doesn't have to be a complex model), sometimes just some loops can make them rethink and realize the benefits from the method.
@Giovanni, about the paper I am with you. I have worked with MarkusStamm a few years ago on that issue while still at BMW. It is probably more about an OD and group dynamics issue than a technical SD application. Happy to connect, my Skype is Frisbeeralf, ralf_lippold@web.de
Cheers, and best regards
Ralf
Hi JJ,
I have lived and worked in an environment (BMW Plant Leipzig) where the plant manager has been a strong promoter of SD. However within the middle-part of the organization you always deal with the kind of managers who -at first sight- resist the new method.
Here lies the chance to change the current thinking. It only needs the quick wins to show them the benefits in short time (doesn't have to be a complex model), sometimes just some loops can make them rethink and realize the benefits from the method.
@Giovanni, about the paper I am with you. I have worked with MarkusStamm a few years ago on that issue while still at BMW. It is probably more about an OD and group dynamics issue than a technical SD application. Happy to connect, my Skype is Frisbeeralf, ralf_lippold@web.de
Cheers, and best regards
Ralf
Ralf Lippold
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Lee Jones
JJ
thanks for the thoughts on the two types of "audience" for SD, it's something we've been trying to understand for a while now and we are working on a way to connect with smaller, owner-run businesses as well as to maintain relationships with global organisations. For the latter, the problem is often compounded by the fragility of the connection with the organisation, there is a need not only to manage the expectations of the client project team and chief internal sponsor but the wider organisation. The bigger it is the harder it is in my experience. Of course, projects don't always go as planned and some are less successful than others for a variety of reasons but I have experience of good projects accepted by the client team but only because they are the brightest sparks in the organisation and they "get it". In one particular case the project sponsor was highly intelligent and much more advanced in his thinking than fellow Directors but the message was difficult to get across internally. Once the sponsor left the organisation, well, that was it!
As for smaller businesses more likely to be owner-run, there has to be a completely different approach I think. I am not sure what it is yet but we have to demonstrate the usefulness of what we do and not depend on explanations of models, simulation, technical aspects of Vensim etc. This is true for the larger organisations too but they often have technical groups with internal skills requiring an approach from us that covers the technical aspects as well as the business benefit. In some cases we're only accessing the internal technical guys and, although this is easier to handle without access to the decision makers its likely to fail in the long run.
Lee
thanks for the thoughts on the two types of "audience" for SD, it's something we've been trying to understand for a while now and we are working on a way to connect with smaller, owner-run businesses as well as to maintain relationships with global organisations. For the latter, the problem is often compounded by the fragility of the connection with the organisation, there is a need not only to manage the expectations of the client project team and chief internal sponsor but the wider organisation. The bigger it is the harder it is in my experience. Of course, projects don't always go as planned and some are less successful than others for a variety of reasons but I have experience of good projects accepted by the client team but only because they are the brightest sparks in the organisation and they "get it". In one particular case the project sponsor was highly intelligent and much more advanced in his thinking than fellow Directors but the message was difficult to get across internally. Once the sponsor left the organisation, well, that was it!
As for smaller businesses more likely to be owner-run, there has to be a completely different approach I think. I am not sure what it is yet but we have to demonstrate the usefulness of what we do and not depend on explanations of models, simulation, technical aspects of Vensim etc. This is true for the larger organisations too but they often have technical groups with internal skills requiring an approach from us that covers the technical aspects as well as the business benefit. In some cases we're only accessing the internal technical guys and, although this is easier to handle without access to the decision makers its likely to fail in the long run.
Lee
How to sell SD to managers
Hi Lee
I do not have miracle solutions, but I can give you my thoughts about that problem, at least how I see things up to now, considering that it can change in the future.
I need some time to gather my ideas and to expose them simply enough to be understood while not forgetting something important.
I will then post my answer to your post later on.
Regards.
JJ
I do not have miracle solutions, but I can give you my thoughts about that problem, at least how I see things up to now, considering that it can change in the future.
I need some time to gather my ideas and to expose them simply enough to be understood while not forgetting something important.
I will then post my answer to your post later on.
Regards.
JJ