impossible to switch back to the old gui a model built with the new guide

[LAUJJL]

Hi

Joined a simplistic model that when loaded from the vensim set with the new gui, loads correctly, but once loaded it is impossible to switch to the old gui. If Vensim is open with the old gui set, it is impossible to load the same model. it opens it on the second view, and if one wants to go to the first view, it is impossible and it declares an error that can be reported.

regards.

JJ

[Administrator]

Try the attached.

[LAUJJL]

Hi

Thank you, now it works, even if i do not know how.

Regards

JJ

[LAUJJL]

If I open your model in the download repository, it works fine and I can switch tp the old gui, but if i download the model joined, it generates again an error if Venim is set in the old gui. I am obliged to set Vensim in the new guide, to be able to load the model, And once loaded in the new gui, impossible to witch to the old gui.

The model implssible to switch is joined.

Regards.

JJ

[LAUJJL]

Fortunately this is the only model that cannot be switched to the old guy and cannot be loaded when the old gui is on.

All the models work correctly. I suppose that something happened when building the model with the new gui on.

Anyhow finding the old gui much more practical, i wolk now only with the old gui on.

The model being very small, I built it again with the old gui on, and now it works.

Regards.

JJ

[Administrator]

You have an IO object that is not configured in the model. If you delete it, the model should open ok in the old GUI.

Note : We will be retiring the old GUI fairly soon. It does not work on the Mac at all. If there is anything you still use that is not in the new GUI, let us know.

[LAUJJL]

Very sad new for me, that you will retire the old gui. i tried t use the new gui. Building a model with the new gui, triple my building time.
I will try to keep the present version as long as possible.

JJ

[Administrator]

Very sad new for me, that you will retire the old gui. i tried t use the new gui. Building a model with the new gui, triple my building time.

If you explain why you find it so slow, maybe we can improve it or tell you how to do what you need.

[alvinpoon]

Hi

I have same.experience with LAU
The old.gui is more.user friendly. For example

hide unhide can be done by individual vatiable in olg gui which we just right click mouse bitton and then can select hide level. W

the old gui has partial.simulation whereas new.gui does not have

Old gui can display a small yellow graph when we hover over the variable which are nice geatures.

the optimization and other advanced features in new gui operate in a more compicate manner. I feel

I do mot know why but the new gui cloud size are big and nit know where to adjust. Also.the text box size of the variable are big that the arrows often not closely conne ted in display,which I tried to fix by setting.but failed. Spending quitr a lot of time to adjust this cimestic matter.

New.gui does not allow edit sketch panel

there are no updated help to assist(most gui not updated in vensim help manual)

Just to share my experience and hope it would help and look forward to.new ver enhancement of new gui

Thank you





Hope above will help.

[Administrator]

hide unhide can be done by individual vatiable in olg gui which we just right click mouse bitton and then can select hide level. W

You can now use the toolbar along the bottom of the sketch.

the old gui has partial.simulation whereas new.gui does not have

We found that nobody uses it. Do you actually use partial simulation?

Old gui can display a small yellow graph when we hover over the variable which are nice geatures.

I'll add this as a future enhancement.

the optimization and other advanced features in new gui operate in a more compicate manner. I feel

Really? The sketch is now live meaning you can add things to the optimization window by double clicking them on the sketch.

I do mot know why but the new gui cloud size are big and nit know where to adjust. Also.the text box size of the variable are big that the arrows often not closely conne ted in display,which I tried to fix by setting.but failed. Spending quitr a lot of time to adjust this cimestic matter.

I don't quite understand this. Are you using the new or traditional sketch style?

New.gui does not allow edit sketch panel

Sorry, I do not understand this.

[alvinpoon]

Dear

thank you for your quick reply.

firstly I realized a mistake about hide/unhide usage that I can find the "hide level" button under the option of each variable (click mouse right button)., so it is fine.

regarding the cloud size, it is always big in new gui when i sketch, but when i switch the drawing into old gui, the cloud size become very small. on the other hand, under old gui, the variable box size become bigger that the arrow not tightly linked. I attached the screens shot of the image for your advice.

for the sketch panel, I meant that in old gui, under the tool, there are sketch toolset and analysis toolset to modify, but under new gui, there is only analysis toolset to modify (see attached)

BTW, I found that i cannot hide the small behaviour graph during the Synthesim. see attached screen shot too

thank you

[LAUJJL]

Hi

The difficulties using the new gui, come partially from the fact that it is quite different from the old one, that was rather similar to the still older one that I used so far.

I had found with the time interesting shortcuts that I will have to find again with the new gui.
For instance with the old gui, it was possible to get directly to the equation editor, by right clicking on the sketch variable. Doing that with the new gui seemed to me cumbersome.

The new gui has in the edit text mode, no possibility to run a Venapp and if one wants to run one, one has to switch to the old gui.
About the partial simulation, I have never used it. But I think that if few people use it, it is that there are not enough examples of how to use it with profit in the documentation.

Vensim has become with the time, such a powerful tool, that the documentation has not been able to follow the change.
A powerful tool has a big documentation, and a small change in the tool should trigger a change in all the parts of the documentation referring to that change, something that is often not done. Very often the documentation is still adapted to old versions and not to the new one.
Another remark is about the modeling guide. It is too small compared to the user and reference guide. A powerful tool is nice but at the condition that one knows how to use it. And the modeling guide has only examples and not enough examples on how to conduct a study, step by step.

This is the trap of all sophisticated tools. The more they get sophisticated, the more they get difficult to use.
I think that Vensim should pay more attention in how the tool can be used with profit, than adding more and more features without explaining fully how to use them.
Vensim should build a completely different modeling guide that would to my opinion, better help the success of the tool, than by adding new features.

About the new gui, for which reason did you build it?
What did you dislike with the old one?
When I build now a model, every time that I add something to the model, I ask myself 'what is the utility of the add-on and does it justify the added complexity of the model?'.

But of course this is only the point of view of an end user, not in charge of the tool. Advices are easy to give but generally not so easy to accomplish.

Regards.

JJ

[Administrator]

regarding the cloud size, it is always big in new gui when i sketch, but when i switch the drawing into old gui, the cloud size become very small. on the other hand, under old gui, the variable box size become bigger that the arrow not tightly linked. I attached the screens shot of the image for your advice.

This has been fixed for some time.

for the sketch panel, I meant that in old gui, under the tool, there are sketch toolset and analysis toolset to modify, but under new gui, there is only analysis toolset to modify (see attached)

Yes, this is correct. We found very few users actually change the sketch toolset. You can still do most things with the new one, for example, when drawing an arrow, hold the SHIFT, CTRL or ALT keys to see what you can do.

BTW, I found that i cannot hide the small behaviour graph during the Synthesim. see attached screen shot too

We are going to add that in very soon.

[Administrator]

The difficulties using the new gui, come partially from the fact that it is quite different from the old one, that was rather similar to the still older one that I used so far.

We would hope that it's close enough to the old one that you can easily still do what you need to.

For instance with the old gui, it was possible to get directly to the equation editor, by right clicking on the sketch variable. Doing that with the new gui seemed to me cumbersome.

You can still do this.

The new gui has in the edit text mode, no possibility to run a Venapp and if one wants to run one, one has to switch to the old gui.

Yes, we are working on a replacement for Venapps. Most users want their models on the web, and Venapps are very old and not user friendly at all.

About the new gui, for which reason did you build it?
What did you dislike with the old one?

The old user interface was just that, very very old. It was almost impossible to update or to add functionality. The Mac version was never finished properly, so we took the difficult decision to start again. Vensim should now be future proof, it's written using modern code and toolkits. And updating it is now a very quick process.

[LAUJJL]

Hi

Thank you for your quick reply.

I was about to invest time on Venapps, and I am happy to know that it will no longer be supported.

Is it necessary to wait for the new tool and is it possible to use something else meanwhile?

When will the new tool become available?

I studied the possibilities to put my models on the web. All seem to have limitations.

I want people able to use all the functionalities of my models.

And the only way that I found is to send them a model with the Vensim reader. But I still need a tool to guide them, Venapps seemed interesting or maybe Sable. But is Sable still supported? I could too use the DLL and Excel. But even if I know quite well Excel with VBA, I do not know at all the interfaces that help the presentation of the results in Excel.

Any ideas?

Regards

JJ

[Amistra]

Do you have a timeline for retiring Venapps and introducing web publishing? We have a client that needs a flight simulator in Q2 2024 (preferably April vs June) and web would be a much better solution.

[Administrator]

Do you have a timeline for retiring Venapps and introducing web publishing? We have a client that needs a flight simulator in Q2 2024 (preferably April vs June) and web would be a much better solution.

You can already publish to the web via Vensim DSS. This gives you a model that will happily run in a browser, plus an API that can be used to interface with the model. It's always been our intention to generate this, but more advanced usage would almost certainly require a web-developer to improve things.

So if you need something that is for use by a customer, you probably want to take the current published model, and have a web-developer work on it to make it "production quality". This is not something we can easily do in Vensim, but we can give you the foundations of something.

[Amistra]

Got it - thanks. Yes please can you send the html foundation for the web interface (more for my benefit than the web developer). Thanks!

Al

[Travis]

Also, a great way to put Vensim models on the web is SDEverywhere (sdeverywhere.org). An open source project that is used by several big models, including En-ROADS (www.En-ROADS.org).

SDE has been developed and used for approx 8 years. Tested and still under development.

[Amistra]

Thanks Travis - good to have options.

cheers, Al